Lawrence Dallaglio: 'A real problem and it’s only going to get worse'

Lawrence Dallaglio had plenty to get off his chest last Thursday morning. Seven days earlier, he had stepped off his bicycle one final time, riding into Nice to complete the 2024 edition of the Dallaglio Cycle Slam that had started in Rome on April 13.

He had stated pre-departure that it would be his last tour and that alternative fund-raising events would instead be arranged at Dallaglio RugbyWorks to replace the bi-annual cycle that began in 2010.

However, despite all the lingering aches and pains – and some dark moments that were encountered during the spin up north through Italy and then along the French Riviera – he admitted he could be tempted to do one last hurrah.

“It’s the seventh cycle slam. As you know I played No8. Seven is not my favourite number, so I may well get lured out into doing one more in a few years,” he quipped to RugbyPass, going on to build up a head of steam in a 25-minute interview where his words unhesitatingly flowed.

“I’m sure there will be another something that can be quite exciting. It could be a festival of sport, a festival of rugby. I don’t know. Whatever it might be, it’s just about bringing everyone together and raising awareness for what is something that needs to be dealt with. We have all got young people in our lives and we all want to give them the best possible opportunity."

What nudged Dallaglio into giving back? “I was inspired when I went on one of Ian Botham’s walks for leukemia. I knew when I retired in 2008, I wanted to do something to bring everyone together. Cycling wasn’t a big phenomenon in the UK, it only really exploded in 2012. I’d never been on a road bike before.

“I assessed my options. Running? For someone who had been through a 20-year rugby career, it wasn’t really an option. I’d lost a bit of weight from my rugby-playing days; I’m not really built for cycling, that’s for sure. But cycling is good because it has a low impact on the body in terms of knees and joints.

“This was the seventh bi-annual event. I started in 2010 and I’ve done them every two years bar the pandemic. I have always been quite inspired by bringing lots of people together for a common cause and one of the best things about rugby is touring.

“I learned an awful lot from going away on tour and just having that sense of purpose, that sense of togetherness as a team, that sense of achievement – when you do something on your own it’s a great feeling but when you do it with other people and you help each other along the way, it’s a much greater feeling.

“I hadn’t done a huge amount of training for this particular ride because of commitments, so to have got over the line with everyone else, to be able to still do 150kms a day, lots of climbing, there is a sense of relief.

“The three things you think about are the young people you are working for raising as much money as possible, the sense of achievement with a group of people, and really having a bit of fun along the way – although it wasn’t fun all the way, let me tell you that now. There were some quite dark moments as well. But very proud of the entire group.”

The thing is, there must be something broken in the UK for the soon-to-be 52-year-old to feel compelled to get on his bike on the continent to raise funds to tackle a grave issue – the exclusion of on average 160 young people from school every week – that is really the Government’s problem to fix.

It was in 2009, a year after he retired from playing, when the Wasps legend, a 2003 Rugby World Cup winner with England, launched his foundation. Fifteen years later, it is still fighting the courageous fight and still bemused by the continuing political inertia. Why haven’t the Government upped its game in the last decade and a half?

“I’m not really too sure, to be honest. The idea is about shining a light on a section of society that doesn’t really get the support and help that they need. It’s a bit of a failing of the charity system that 89 per cent of all the funds are given to six per cent of the charities really and the money doesn’t really trickle down.

“It’s one of the things when you look at the stats, it’s a real problem and it’s only going to get worse. I sent you the one-pager about 160 young people being excluded every week from school; 65 per cent of everyone in prison has been excluded.

“Where we are is sort of the last intervention between the ages of 14 and 18 and what the work of the charity shows is that you can actually turn people’s lives around. I have chosen to work with some of the hardest-to-reach young people in society because I’m very passionate about the fact that just because you are excluded from school, you shouldn’t be excluded from society really.

“It’s working. We work with over 2,000 young people every year. When I set the charity up I could have worked with young kids and given hundreds of thousands of people a rugby ball, but this is about working with a smaller group of young people and actually having a meaningful impact on their lives. The charity’s work is literally life-changing, something I’m very proud of.”

The target by 2027 is to assist more than 7,000 teenagers per annum, an ambitious figure given it’s already quite the battle in the congested charity space to secure the £1.7million currently needed to run the RugbyWorks programme across seven UK regions.

“The need for our work is there,” insisted Dallaglio, whose passion to help provide a lasting fix was clear as he spoke. “There is no doubt with the numbers I mention, 160 being excluded every week, we could be working with so many more. We are a nationwide charity and it’s about awareness of the problem and the willingness of organisations to really want to help young people in this particular space.

“Ninety-five per cent of all of our fundraising is done through events but obviously you could argue that the charity is doing the government’s job for them really. We have an 84 per cent success rate in terms of getting young people into full-time employment and education.

“When you think the cost to society and us as taxpayers is enormous when someone is put in prison (an estimate of £370,000 per young person across their lifetime in education, benefits, healthcare, and criminal justice costs), it is an intervention that is worth doing. Look, as I said, the need for our work is there. We just need to make sure that everyone else understands and realises that.”

Dallaglio’s backstory about the need for someone to genuinely care makes a convincing case. The Londoner wasn’t a deprived youngster; he was schooled at the famed Ampleforth College in York. But life went off the rails following the tragic death of his sister Francesca in 1989 at the age of just 19 and it was only joining Wasps on a whim the following year that eventually broke the depressive spiral.

“Look, I don’t profess to come from a chaotic background necessarily. I had a very sound upbringing but in ’89 when I lost my sister on the Marchioness riverboat disaster, I had a couple of years where things were definitely heading in a different direction.

“I spent a lot of time throughout my rugby career supporting many charities. All very worthy. Help for Heroes, Wooden Spoon, Cancer Research UK. When I retired, I just felt very responsible and wanted to give something back. When I joined Wasps in 1990, I didn’t join because I wanted to be a rugby player. Rugby wasn’t really a pathway. It was an amateur sport played on a Tuesday and Thursday night.

“I joined because I needed something to help me turn my life around, a sense of family, a sense of community and that is exactly what rugby gave me. I just needed someone to put their arms around me and help and support me. That was the why I played rugby and that was the why post-rugby career I wanted to give something back.

“No young people are born bad. They are just born into quite chaotic circumstances and all they need is a support system, a bit of self-esteem, a sense of purpose, a bit of trust, and consistency. That is what rugby did for me and look, rugby is the hook for this charity. It could be football, boxing, the arts, anything. I’m not the person who is going to get lots of young people playing rugby in this particular environment but what rugby has is the ability to really help these young people and the results are there.

“I have always been in a profession where it has always been about getting the right results, so this is not a vanity project in any way whatsoever. It takes up a lot of my time but it’s something I am perfectly happy and willing to give. This is about working with a small group of people.

“Whether it is 2,000 or 7,000, it’s still a relatively small group of people but it’s about having a meaningful impact on their lives, and the charity and the work of our coaches and all the people that work with us is absolutely life-changing. Look, I’m still here, what is it, 15 years later with my name above the door, we’re in schools all over the UK and have got an incredible team.

“We’re partnered with the British and Irish Lions now and have just been confirmed as one of their charity partners. We have worked with several different corporate organisations and it’s starting to really move forward positively.

“But as you said, the problem is not going away. The exclusions in the UK are at an all-time high, about 160 a week between the ages of 14 and 17 which is actually a very worrying statistic. Post-covid that problem is only going to get worse really, so there appears to be this cycle going on where more and more young people are getting excluded.

“The reasons for exclusion are very different. Most young people are born into quite chaotic circumstances. As I said, no young kids are born bad, it’s just the history of violent abuse, domestic abuse, generational unemployment, generational illiteracy.

"There is a whole myriad of reasons why young people are in this situation and the charity needs to work with them and with the schools they are in and give them every opportunity in life.

“There are a lot of issues for young people in modern society and this government, the next government, and the one after that have got to pay a little more attention and not just ignore it because often this type of work with these types of young people, they are very much stereotyped, and it doesn’t get the visibility or the investment it needs from government.

“Too often we look to deal with things in the short term as opposed to the long term and what we have highlighted as a charity is that if you invest in young people, you can change behaviours, you can turn the problems around.”

How did Wasps fix Dallaglio all those years ago? “I was a bit troubled and disenfranchised and just not in a great headspace really. My parents were really struggling, we were grieving really, and I knew I needed something to change my focus and because I played rugby at school, I don’t know, something just pointed me in that direction, pointed me towards Wasps.

“It’s probably the reason why I ended up staying for 20 years because it was much more of a personal journey for me. Rugby was never about how much money I made. I mean, the first six years being at Wasps, it cost us money to play Tuesday and Thursday night, and then suddenly the game goes professional and you have got a choice to make.

“For me, the journey through rugby was much more a spiritual one and I was always driven by wanting to do something much more personal. Putting my parents back together, honouring the memory of my sister, etc, etc, so that was the thing really.

“Rugby has an unfair reputation for being a white, middle-class, elitist sport but from the very first day at Wasps, I walked into a place that celebrated difference and didn’t ask any questions, didn’t stereotype, just very happy to put their arms around me and help me move forward.”

That bond persists even though Wasps no longer exist, falling prey in October 2022 to ruinous financial pressures accelerated by the pandemic. “I was never drawn to rugby for the money and my why I played was very personal and very, very close to my heart. It was driven by family and therefore the opportunities to play it elsewhere and earn more money were there but that wasn’t my driver.

“Everyone has ambitions in life and if you want to earn a decent amount of money you wouldn’t necessarily go into a career in rugby. Even now I don’t think it’s as appealing as it once was. I stayed at the club because I felt very passionate that it was a very personal journey.

“I look back on my career and ended up with 22 trophies and no money. I’m not worried about that. You can’t put a price on that. Even though we don’t exist as a professional rugby club at the moment we have an incredible support network amongst the group and are still very much in touch.”

That said, rugby perhaps needs to promote itself better. “Concussion fills the conversation these days. The optics of rugby in terms of the way we talk about our own sport are not great and that needs to change significantly.

“I work in broadcasting, and we have a responsibility to deliver and portray the sport in the right light. As I keep saying to people, we all like flying airplanes but if you keep showing planes crashing at Heathrow airport in slow motion then eventually you are going to get put off flying. So rugby needs to understand and own itself as a sport.”

• Click here to access the Dallaglio Cycle Slam 2024 fundraising page